Thread:Jallybwan/@comment-32783587-20180109025223/@comment-32783587-20180124011816

Jallybwan wrote: Anons unite wrote:

'''But he knows everything! so he still knows what will happen to them once they are created. so he is basically sending people to hell by creating them. '''Did you totally miss what I said about Jesus? God cannot abide sin, but we still choose to sin. As I said, you wouldn't blame your parents for a plate you broke.

NO NO NO YOURE MISSING MY POINT. GOD IS ALL KNOWING, SO HE WILL KNOW WHICH PEOPLE WILL END UP SINNING AND WHICH WONT. TAKE HITLER. IS IT REALLY WORTH KILLING THAT MANY PEOPLE JUST TO SATISFY THE FORCED GIDT ANALOGY.

'''like for example, he knows that his creations, Adam and Eve, would eat the forbidden fruit (NO, not tide pods you idiots. my drugged goldfish died from eating tide pods and im very offended at that meme). and lets take all of the people that are in hell now. he knew that they would end up in there, so why not intervene and show his a- im sorry, show himself?''' Anons, all the people who go to Hell on Judgement Day is there because of their own refusal of Jesus. It says that every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that Jesus is Lord - but they still have to CHOOSE to let Jesus take away their sin.

SO IF IM ATHIEST WHEN I DIE AND I SAY OKAY FINE I ADMIT IT IM WRONG. JESUS YOURE REAL. I GO TO HEAVEN? OR PURGATORY? OR WHAT IF I SAY NOPE LOL PROLLY JUST A FAKE JESUS I GO TO HELL? ALSO STILL MISSING MY POINT. GOD IS OMNIPOTENT, SO HE KNOWS WHO WILL END UP SINNING. SO HE SHOULD EITHER 1. NOT MAKE SINNERS IN THE FIRST PLACE (IF YOU ARGUE THAT GOD CREATES PEOPLE) OR INTERVENE SOMEHOW, DOESNT HAVE TO BE SEVERE (IF YOU ARGUE THAT GOD DIDNT HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH HITLER). KILLING ALL JEWS OUTWEIGHS THE FORCED GIFT. THERE IS WAY TOO MUCH BAD IN THE WORLD FOR THERE TO BE A "PERFECT" ALL KNOWING BEING IS WHAT IM SAYING.

'''the forced gift thing does not apply here, because you're literally trying to save someone from a fate worse than death. '''You really didn't read what I said about Jesus. If someone's about to fall from a cliff, and you put your hand out to reach them, but they refuse to take it - you can't force them to.

AS I KEEP SAYING GOD WILL KNOW THAT YOU WILL END UP NOT ACCEPTING JESUS. IF HE FINDS OUT "SAID PERSON WILL ACCEPT JESUS IF I DO SAID THING" HE SHOULD DO SAID THING FOR THAT PERSON, AS LONG AS ITS MINOR. PUTTING AS MANY PEOPLE IN HEAVEN IS GOD'S GOAL, SO WHY IS HE NOT DOING IT? LIKE DID GANDHI (NON CHRISTIAN/GOOD PERSON) GO TO HELL I MIGHT HAVE ALREADY ASKED THIS BUT I FORGOT

'''and the "mistakes are learning experinces" is probably true in most cases, but lots of these "life lessons" from god are from fictional stories, and the bible. see where im going with this? '''Prove it's fictional. There is archaeological evidence supporting a lot of the Bible, actually. They found the walls of Jericho, for example.

SURE THE BIBLE CAN BE REAL, BUT THAT DOES NOT MEAN GOD IS REAL. THE BIBLE WAS WRITTEN BY MAN. THERES EVIDENCE FOR THE BIG BANG AND EVOLUTION TOO, YOU KNOW. AND THAT SEEMS MORE LIKELY THEN SOME CRAZY ALL KNOWING BEING THAT I HAVE NEVER ONCE SEEN OR HEARD. ALSO, IF HUMANS EVOLVED FROM APES, THERE ARE STILL APES TODAY DUE TO SPLITTING OF A COMMON ANCESTOR; IN OTHER WORDS, SOME TYPES OF APES DID NOT EVOLVE OR EVOLVED SLOWER, BUT A CERATIN TYPE OF APE DID EVOLE INTO HUMANS. THE OTHER APES THAT DID NOT EVOLVE ARE THE APE RACE WE SEE TODAY. SEE, THIS IS THE PROBLEM WITH CHRISTIANS- GOING AGAINST ALL LAWS OF PHYSICS (WITH THE LAW OF GOD) AND SCIENCE (BIG BANG, EVOLUTION). SCIENCE IS CLEARLY THE MORE MODERN, MORE SCIENTIFIC, "SMARTER" ROUTE THAN A BEING WITH UNLIMITED POWER CREATED THOUSANDS OF YEARS AGO (WHEN PEOPLE WERE CAVEMEN AND COULDNT EVEN COMPREHEND A SENTENCE (/S)).

'''but all of those sects still go to heaven right? what about jews, do they go to heaven if they are halfway there, but not fully? also, what about all the religions that have nothing to do with jesus, like ones where you worship hundereds of deities. '''Jesus is "The way, the truth and the life. Nobody gets to His Father but through Him." How many times do I have to explain "you have to give Jesus your sin"?

SO THE ANSWER IS NO? AND WHY IS JESUS SO IMPORTANT? WHY NOT GOD HIMSELF, OR JUST BEING A GOOD PERSON? THATS MUCH MORE FAIR THAN HAVING TO BOW DOWN TO SOMEONE, YOU KNOW?

'''once again though, he knew his creation would sin since he knows EVERYTHING. '''He knew we would sin, but He made us anyway because He wants a relationship with us. Instead, you decide to blame Him for all of your suffering - even when He's literally the only reason you exist. If He were cruel, He wouldn't have made a way into Heaven.

 BUT IF HE WERE NICE, HE WOULDNT HAVE EVEN MADE A PLACE WHERE PEOPLE CONSTANTLY SUFFER... THINK THE OTHER SIDE OF THE COIN. THE RELATIONSHIP IS A GOOD POINT CANT ARGUE WITH THAT.

'''you could argue "well technically god didnt make hitler, his parents did" but lets say you created something a few years ago that has to do with hitlers birth, you would know that said hitler would be created and kill millions, right? '''God made Hitler as well, and Hitler made his choices. But God also promises to never waste suffering - WW2 heavily raised awareness of Jewish people. I'm fairly certain that the Jews got Israel back as compensation.

BUT I DONT THINK THATS WORTH THE MASS SLAUGHTERING. ALSO THERE ARE STILL QUITE A FEW PEOPLE WHO HATE JEWS TODAY.

'''side note- screw hitler but i dont think he deserves to be in hell. no im not racist, just no one should burn forever i dont care how bad you are. anyway so if youre creating, you should make them all christians. that is not a dictatorship, its making everyone happy as countless deaths would be saved from wars over religion. why create people of opposite religions if they are just going to end up with satan? '''Forced gift. He gave us free will, and we abuse it. He only allows us to keep our free will because He loves us so much.

NO NO NO.... WHICH DO YOU THINK PROVES GOD'S LOVE MORE- KEEPING HIMSELF SECRET SO PEOPLE HAVE TO ACTIVELY SEEK OUT TO FIND EVIDENCE OF HIM- OR BE A NICE PERSON AND SHOW HIMSELF TO EVERYONE TO SHUT ATHIESTS UP? NOT IN A FORCED WAY- BUT RATHER A NICE, WELCOMING WAY. THAT IS WAY WAY NICER THAN THE FIRST OPTION

'''huh? i dont really understand. we all deserve to be in hell? what about people that have not sinned ever? '''People who have never sinned technically wouldn't need Jesus. But good luck finding anyone perfect that ISN'T Jesus.

GOD? WELL, I OBVIOUSLY THINK HES FAR FROM PERFECT... BUT FROM A CHRISTIANS PERSPECTIVE.

<span style="color:rgb(68,68,68);font-size:12px;font-weight:400;">'''his argument is what if its a 2 year old that doesnt even know what jesus is, or how to talk? then how do you accept something? '''This is covered bu that second-chance thing. If God could create the universe, He could make a baby understand Him. And then it's up to the baby.

<span style="color:rgb(68,68,68);font-size:12px;font-weight:400;">SO WHY CANT HE JUST DO THAT WHEN THE BABY IS ALIVE, RATHER THAN DEAD? SEEMS REDUDANT TO WAIT THAT LONG.

'''the thread is long dead. but there are still some active religious argument threads. just search on google "would you rather live poorly with jesus or richly with satan". another good relgious argument question is "would you rather die to find out there is no god but be religious" or "die to find out there is a god and be athiest"''' - I'd rather be an atheist my whole life and realize that God exists when I die - then I could accept Him. But this is a moot question anyway, since there is a God. SO YOU'RE 100% CERTAIN THAT THERE IS A GOD, NOT ONE DOUBT IN YOUR MIND. YOU DODGED IT THE FIRST TIME. IMA SAY IM 99% SURE THERES NO GOD. THERE IS A POSSIBILITY. BUT YOU CANNOT BE 100% SURE IF YOU ARE. BEING TOUCHED BY GOD, MAYBE A DREAM? SEEMS UNLIKELY, RIGHT? WELL, "UNLIKELY" IS NOT "IMPOSSIBLE"

'''also some more things. you know evolution, or the jesus savior thing, or many other common beliefs of Christianity are not in the bible. Well, that means at least .1% of the bible is not true (leaving important info out is still not good). '''Give an example, or this point is invalid. Many people have taken facts out of the Bible and twisted them, some things were lost in translation (difference between day/eon for example) etc.

CHRSITIANS WITHIN THEMSELVES HAVE SO MANY DIFFERENT OPINIONS ABOUT GOD. ITS SO CONFUSING EVEN TO THEM, WHICH IS A HINT THAT ITS JUST UNCLEAR AND NOT REAL (LIKE THE TRANSLATIONS). THATS MY POINT. BUT ATHEISM, WHILE NOT ALL THE SAME, IS A MORE MODERN APPROACH TO RETHINK THIS WHOLE OMNIPOTENT BEING THING. SURE ONLY 10% IS ATHIEST, BUT IT IS RISING. ONCE WE HAVE AI AND ALL THAT CRAP, RELIGION WILL BE A THING OF THE PAST.

'''so if .1% isnt true, then why should the other 99.9 percent. no one creates something (factual) that is somewhat true, somewhat fake. its either completely true or completely false. '''You haven't proven anything incorrect, so why should we believe you when you say it's a lie?

NOAHS ARC/ARK (I FORGET SORRY) IS A LIE. WELL, ACTUALLY, I CANT REALLY SAY THAT BECAUSE THERE ARE MANY OTHER BIZARRE THINGS LIKE JUST MAGICALLY CREATING A WHOLE UNIVERSE IN AN INSTANT, WHICH, NOT ONLY WOULD BREAK EVERY LAW OF PHYSICS KNOWN, WOULD HAVE TO MAKE THE WHOLE SCIENTIFIC COMMUNITY RETHINK IT. SO SURE I CANT PROVE IT FALSE BUT YOU CANT PROVE THIS CRAZY STUFF TRUE.

'''also noahs ark is impossible. he could not bring one of every animal on earth on a giant ship in that amount of time. '''If Noah were working alone. But nope, he was acting under God's orders.

WELL, UNDER THE WELL-STUDIED LAWS OF PHYSICS YES. BUT UNDER SOME OMNIPOTENT BEING CREATED THOUSANDS OF YEARS AGO WITH VERY, VERY LITTLE PROOF, THEN NO.

'''some of the story seems like fairy tale to me. well, i mean, in the dreaded athiestic worldview, all of it does, simply because there is not enough evidence to believe in that, and an all knowing being watching us just seems unlikely. '''Tell that to all the archaeologists who have FOUND evidence supporting the Bible. Far more than any evidence against it. But you probably still wouldn't believe, because you don't WANT to believe. You'll find some excuse as to "oh it's fake" like so many before you.

IF I GAVE YOU GOOD ENOUGH EVIDENCE THAT YOU WOULDNT BELIEVE, WOULD YOU GIVE UP YOUR RELIGION? PROBABLY NOT. THEN DO NOT GO SAYING THAT TO ME WHEN YOU WOULD PROBABLY NOT GIVE UP GOD AT GUNPOINT. AND THE BIBLE EVIDENCE IS PRETTY NOT BAD, BUT THE ACTUAL EVIDENCE OF THE GOD? ANY EVIDENCE OF NOAHS ARK/ARC, SUCH AS THE REMNANTS OF IT? OR MORE THINGS BEING MAGICALLY CREATED BY GOD LIKE HE USED TO?

'''it was created just to make us better people by giving us lessons. which, it has failed horribly, because there are many wars of christianity, not to mention all religions. '''A teacher cannot force his student to be a good student. He can try to, but it's still the student's choice to act up. So if anything's failed here, it's the human race.

BUT THE DIFFERENCE IS, A TEACHER DOES NOT KNOW THAT HE WOULD BE A BAD STUDENT IN THE FIRST PLACE. THEY ARE NOT ALL KNOWING