Board Thread:Debate of The Week/@comment-28112409-20181230235210/@comment-28112409-20190101222227

WolfiZee wrote: Jamieawesome wrote: Ok let me rephrase that statement:

Disguiser is better than Framer

State otherwise > It has to die, eliminating at least 1/4 of the, to do it's job at all.

> It is not garunteed your disguise will fool the

> It is not garunteed that fooling the will make a difference

> The slot spent with a could be spent doing something that doesn't require a  member to die, such as investigating people like the, or... really, anything. Even the doesn't have to die to do anything. These are Joe Schmoe arguments, they don't hold.

Its ability triggers upon death, that doesn't mean it has to die to do its job. I don't think a single one of you Joe Schmoes complaining about Disguiser know how to even play him.

Disguiser's ability is not your "job". It's your backup plan. Mafia have suffered with an issue where they can be indecisive about faking their claim, and if they were to be killed while faking said claim and putting mafia roles in it in an attempt to confirm each other as innocent, the town would just link it up and lynch the other mafia.

As Disguiser, you don't have that problem. You can fake to your heart's content without worrying about people finding out you were lying and such, because good will faking and even decent mafia coordination leads to the disguise being pulled off, potentially even cusing mislynches and misexecutions. The key with Disguiser is to be active so you look more like the role you're faking from the early game rather than someone who just faked on the spot. You need to be decisive and you need to be consistent. If your faking is not good and you're letting people's suspicions get more and more justified, of course the disguise won't fool anyone.

Faking a role is a skill any evil has, so saying you suddenly can't do it with Disguiser which is a role that capitalizes on the faking of a role correctly, means you are incompetent as an evil player rather than the Disguiser being bad.

It's not guaranteed that fooling the Sheriff or the Investigator will change anything when you play as Framer, so those 2 equalize each other.

It is not guaranteed your disguise will fool the town, but Framer's chances are far worse because it can only counter 2 roles and has a very low chance of both Sheriff/Invest and Framer visiting someone. Framer has a much worse time trying to make the frames succeed, while Disguiser only needs to leech from one town role and can fake on from there.

The 4th point is countered by what I said for the first, essentially the same thing. You're not supposed to try and die with Disguiser, that's not how the role is played.