Board Thread:Role Ideas (Town)/@comment-39067078-20190814030947/@comment-35356104-20190816104844

Cupcake for y'all, and have a nice day. Shamelessly allow myself to wrap everything up :P

Everyone here is right. Mr. Rasengan had firstly talked about the purpose of this role, but Gob responded with the highlight of its '''potential. Soon, both reach consensus of suggestions to improve the role that consolidate its efficiency'''.

Purpose thing is the most important component in a role. A role can easily be disputed if its purpose is not on the right track. Regardless of how balanced a Firefighter role can be, as long as it exists with intention to hardcounter Arso, it is rejected. How to know if a purpose is good? Firstly, check if it is healthy. No hardcountering, no negative utility, not solely for chaos, not to increase winrate (winrate is a reflection of balance problem, one shouldn't broke the balance more, like making a rampage Unstoppable SK, just to balance out winrate).

Once you find the purpose of a role is good, proceed to check its practicality. Is it too minor? How and why would people use it? For example: I want to encourage discussion among Mafia. I create "Mind-reader" to make a day chatbox for Mafia anonymous to the public. Could it be useful? No idea, unless I'm Consig or have important message like hitting an immune. A simple whisper already sufficient to convey the thing. Or discuss about what to claim or how to defense oneself? We all know what is the best for ourselves, and we have better confidence in what claim, right? While pasting will quickly is the simpliest yet effective way of defense, make more speech only make one more looks suspicious. Not really of a practical useful core idea cause it's a bit insignificant to begin with, while it hardly possesses any quality to be used.

For your case, Rasen casted a little doubt on the purpose expressing how scumreading can be done in a manual way without mechanical aid. But Gob rebutted that there could be marginal error in manual scumreading. Both are right, and that's the grey area. I reviewed a role who peek on others Last Will, I said it is not useful cause people throw last will for almost any reason, there's no need to check on theirs when you can just accuse to get their will revealed. Some says it is op, cause not only it does know a role but also their information, this makes it a buffed Consig. Who knows what's right or wrong XD This is for the purpose part :)

Speaking of potential, it is by far a theoretical matter. Potential is, Disguiser can fool the Town into mislynch by framing somebody in their Last Will with a creditable disguise, Framer lead people to believing someone Inno is evil by manipulating investigative of Sheriff and Inves, or Forger can deceive Town by forging a will on the right role. Are these guaranteed to happen? No, but only some ideal outcomes within their capability, a good prediction and vision about a role, that's what a potential is. The potential of this role is what God has said: "by singling out words that the target said the most, experienced players should be able to deduce a target's intentions." Btw, how to measure this potential thing?

Firstly, check condition for things to happen. Misleading of a Framer needs to have: Presence of Sheriff/Inves, Sheriff/Inves has the same target as Framer, and Sheriff/Inves to speak out their findings. What's the probability for them to appear? Who decides their appearance? RNG. That's the matter of luck. How to have the same target as them? Unless they told everyone they're checking who, otherwise it's still thing with luck. Do you know when are they going to speak out? I don't know, hope them aren't some passive Towns. Look at these variables, which is the one that players can control about? That's what makes a role inconsistent. For this role, what are the requirements for the scumreading to success? Players' scumreading skill & opponent's scumslip. Scumreading skill is determined by how experienced (knowledge), observant (characteristic), attentive (emotional state) the players are. Are these components change at player's will? Furthermore, scumslips, loophole in evils' behaviorism that expose their identity, could be there or could not be there, see how well they cover-up. But what makes them cover-up better? :) For scene you simulate: "you can tell when someone is considerably talking about the Arsonist alot when there is in fact a werewolf", is it common for that to happen?

Secondly, compare. Gob said it, to be able to compete with roles within its alignment. Think, is Framer worth substitution of BMer is RM slot? That's where swingyness started. I might have said something about "productivity & efficiency" in the thread about your approach in reviewing. Yup, similarly to that, compare da best outcome of a role, and if they're on the same level, check its consistency in leading to that desirable outcome, like Disg, Framer & Forger all aimed for mislynch, but who does that better & easier? This role helps to scumread and catch a scum, Sheriff can tell who's suspicious or innocent. But in what form the result is presented? Which is more creditable & accurate?

Thirdly, about negative potential, risk. What if the potential has failed? Vigilante shooting an innocent? Veteran massacre a whole chunk of Townies? Transporter send a wagon of Town to commit genocide in the mouth of WW? Risks come naturally, and role is balanced with risks. Role without risks is equivalent to the taboo, “silver bullet” referring to the role that can never get wrong. Every role different level of “gamble” to play, except TI & Doc which is kind of reasonable, and Retribrokenist (this is what Vert calls it). It takes out aspect of “playing” when people wouldn’t have a second thought about the consequences they might face upon a wrong step. Some role may not have risks, then add more manipulatable condition or requirement for ability to happen or some drawback would be better, for instance, BG dying counterattack if it isn’t protected by TP. Like what was suggested by Gob, penalty of 1 key deducted for a wrong vote is quite fair. But, thing to take note is that, risk, drawback & condition are counterweights for its potential. Always in-check if these aspects are rightfully worthy for what it is aimed to result.

Efficiency  finally! is a spectrum of a role’s usefulness/effectiveness, while potential is a part of it, another part of is the consistent basis. Potential is not warranted, but basis of consistent is something that happen almost or every time the ability is used or activating certain attribute or mechanic. Consolidating efficiency, means increasing the role’s capability in producing consistent and quality result. Forger may mislead Town into mislynching, but it isn’t a frequent occasion. On the other side, hide off the true Last Will of its target is the basis of consistent, which works every single time whether the will is changed or simply be removed. Opening 3rd filling cabinet slot, if the result is in the form of clue which requires player to scumread and deduce from it, fulfilling the purpose to catch scum wouldn’t be as consistent as knowing the exact alignment/role of it, for scumreading is skill that varies from one to another, everchanging under different circumstances. Consistency is the sense of progression, one should emphasize more on this part instead of potential, for better significance in a role. Consistent basis is determined with its effectiveness, while effectiveness is judged on its impact. Framer can be framing throughout the game but no mislynching happen. This role can get a lot of key word from players but get no helpful read from those results. We couldn’t call it consistent cause every same action doesn’t result the same. Consistent is like, sheriff can interrogate every night, and every action gives an exact result, knowing good & evil are both valuable.

Thanks for reading buds~ Take these as a grain of salt. Not necessarily right XD