Board Thread:Role Ideas (Coven)/@comment-28092296-20180922144925/@comment-28092296-20180926000404

@ZedKiller

I am not just looking to see if my changes are good/bad, but also how to fix them and make them better. I would appreciate it if you also gave me feedback to improve, or just to revert changes to the default role. You did make helpful suggestions, but most were suggestions that I didn't make good changes without a way to change them.

Here are some things you missed:

- You are very rude

- "'''The role should always mess asround with this, removing it just confirms the Hex Master instantly. Oh, HM result while theres no vamps and jester is dead. Must be framer/HM, instant lynch. This gives them zero claimspace by removing it." '''I'd suggest an invest result change for the Hex Master instead, then?

- "'''Not only does this negate and instantly prove who ISN'T coven, it also confirms a HM exists. Gamemodes like VIP mode or Ranked Practice is a devastation to this." '''Maybe if Hypnotist gains the ability to screw around with things this would be different? I mean, you could make the same argument with the Blackmailer or Spy's visit tracker, but that's not a big issue in most people's eyes. I would suggest that we alter the actual VIP and Ranked gamemodes themselves and have the Hex Master be balanced in All Any/Normal mode.

-"'''The Potion Master is more accurate than a Consigliere because it involves magic and it makes sense overall since you have a long cooldown. Healing should not be removed whatsoever." '''That ignores the necronomicon ability and I did not remove healing. However, this feedback has been taken into considering. Maybe just change the necronomicon ability?

-"'''This is a major nerf, forcing the Potion Master to copy the Mafioso-type of trend with constant kills, which YOU have stated to not directly relate to the Mafia in any way." '''You can alternate between healing and revealing, actually. If an every-other-day cooldown, you aren't forced to kill, or even attack at all.

-"Hey let's nerf the Medusa to become a killing Forger, cause that's useful. When a role is killed it narrows down what is left. Having secrecy is NEEDED." Regardless of the fact that Forgers can choose what their wills say, the point of this nerf was to make Medusa weaker and less like a Janitor

​​​​​-"'''Useless, I'd rather have it so poisons can't be seen once you have Necro AND can't be healed." '''Makes sense, I can change that if most people oblige with your feedback here

-"If you rely on controlling killers to win, this basically means "okay controlling bob into jailor, oh now i cant control him so he kills me, sweet" Generally, once a CL controls a killer, they don't stop controlling that killer. You can use deathnotes (if I added those) or make a town claim to get around this. If you don't like this, please propose a solution.

-"This is just a major nerf to the Coven overall that completely ruins what makes the Coven the Coven. The Coven can have similarities to the Mafia, but the factions are different in terms of use" The Coven is focused around killing, yes, but they should not be a rehash of roles like Doctor, Consigliere and Arsonist. They should be unique, and they still should have some utilization with their faction communicating abilities. I do take this sentence into consideration.