Board Thread:Role Ideas (Mafia)/@comment-38593192-20200219083045/@comment-32881402-20200220180744

That's not how most roles work. Witch was given consig abilities to make it better and more consistent. This way it knows what it's doing. And even if it didn't have them, it's controlling 1 person into doing something to another person. Whilst it might not know exactly what it's doing, there's very little other people can do about it. So witch is consistently able to do what it does, apart from role blockers (which affect every role).

Retri is powerful, but that doesn't mean it should be near useless if painter rolls... Painter would force retri to revive early in the game when few people have paintings, which would make it significantly less useful since the more important roles (TP and TPow) are unlikely to be dead so early. It's much more than an indirect nerf imo, not necessarily a hard counter because of how inconsistent it is, but it would need testing to see how effective the spreading of paintings actually is. Its interaction with retributionist wouldn't be as much of an issue if the spreading of paintings wasn't so fast... Painter essentially gets 2 paintings per night (since the vast majority of roles visit).

I never said this should replace janitor, I was just referring to it because it's a good example of something which causes retri to be "indirectly nerfed" without hardcountering it.

I'm not saying it can't be discussed further, I'm just giving my opinion about why its unlikely to work. A role can't be "balanced" if it's very inconsistent, even if the inconsistencies average out - just because werewolf might average 1KPN does not make it a good role.