Board Thread:Debate of The Week/@comment-28112409-20171002223259/@comment-26234016-20171004192108

FirePyre wrote: Playful Trickster 101 wrote: Team Mafia FTW Because even though Mafia can be detected easily like Coven, the Mafia's roles are much more balanced than the Coven. The Coven itself depends on Necronomicon too much, and some roles like Poisoner, Potion Master, and Medusa need to be played wisely if they haven't get the Necronomicon. The dependent on Necronomicon is the thing that makes me not fond of the Coven alignment.

You say that the Coven's roles are dependent on the Necronomicon, I say that you'd make that exact same argument against the mafia if they had their own version of the Necronomicon, even if the unbuffed roles were exactly the same as they are now.

''' But Mafia doesn't, and speculation is kinda pointless, isn't it? '''

'''The Necronomicon is an amazing and useful buff, yes, but the Coven roles are able to stand without it. Just becase they can be more more powerful, doesn't mean they aren't already more powerful.'''

''' They aren't, really. I don't think Coven has ever won a game before getting the necronomicon. '''

'''And making the argument that the Coven need to be played wisely is a fair argument, but it applies to literally every role. There is no role in the entire game which is not more useful to it's team if it is played wisely and strategy is used. There is no role in the entire game that is more useful if not played wisely, and of all the roles you cannot argue that the Coven's roles are ones that are completely useless if played dumbly, because even if you're a retard the only way to mess up with that kind of power is to not use it.'''

As for the Mafia, the don't need some sort of buff like Necronomicon, and they can still rekt Town if the team is good, or the opposing side is just a stupid donkey. They can perform direct killings without need to wait for a cool down, they can deceive Town and turn them against each other, and you can even use the information you obtain to eliminate important roles of the Town.

'''They can perform direct killings without need for a cooldown, yes, but that makes them predictable in a way that the Coven is not, and predictability is only a good thing for your enemies. The Coven can deceive town and instigate paranoia, and with the Coven Leader the Coven have the ability to detect and eliminate important town members similarly to the mafia.'''

''' Predictable? Predictable ? If the mafia is anything, it is not predictable. Besides, with the spy nerf, Mafia is able to function so well as a shadow manipulator that I've had games where I was MVP as Disguiser. **Disguiser**! '''

The best thing of the Mafia, unlike Coven roles, is that when no Mafia killing roles left, any random Mafia would be promoted to a Mafioso. This is a very useful asset unlike the Coven. So even when the Godfather and Mafioso died, the remaining Mafia can still turned the tables on.

'''But this removes the aspect you mentioned of the mafia being able to deceive town and turn them against each other or use information to detect and eliminate important town members. '''

''' It also keeps the town guessing on what the mafia has and when. In All Any, the assumption is always that Mafia have all five, even when they only have two or three. '''

'''And with the Necronomicon, when the Coven is in a bad spot they have just as much ability to turn the tables. Overall, this point makes no sense because you're acting like it only applies to mafia. Yes, only mafia have roles that can directly become killing roles, that they don't have guaranteed super-buffs coming their way.'''

''' BUT Coven doesn't have roles that can become immune at night, and Coven doesn't have the same level of secrecy. '''

So basically the reason why I chose Mafia over Coven is because I don't the dependance on Necronomicon too much, since only with it they can kill directly (e.g. Coven Leader and Poisoner, since Doctor or GA can easily thwarted the killing unless they have Necronomicon but AHHH.). The dependance on the Necronomicon is just too much and without it, Coven is basically useless.

'''Not true. But even if the Coven was dependent on the Necronomicon, they never have a game where they don't receive it, so it's not like this is necessarily a bad thing. There is no situation where they aren't going to get the Necronomicon.'''

''' What about when they get lynched d3? '''

Thanks for reading my opinion, have a great day!

Thanks!

''' Thanks! '''

Can Coven win with three people? When it comes to whatever your three favorite Coven roles are, I doubt that they would win more than, say, a Godfather, Janitor, and Consigliere.