Board Thread:Role Ideas (Neutral)/@comment-36558623-20180922232736/@comment-36558623-20181016205026

Addfire wrote: Alright, here's the next issue:

There is nothing threatening about the Preacher whatsoever. It is only an extremely powerful kingmaker, one with a ridiculously easy win condition. I'm going to base this off of Ranked because that's the mode that this role would most likely be in.

'''The Preacher gives evils an extra 'vote,' because if Followers were on Towns side, they would convert back to the Town to be more useful. So it's doubling the amount of votes.'''

First, this role benefits the town because it would be taking the place of an actually harmful role. ,, and all benefit when the town suffers. The Preacher does not hurt the town, no less than a hurts the town. So the town gets a huge benefit there simply with the Preacher existing.

'''Well remember that a Preacher is Neutral Evil, meaning that Followers are more votes. It's almost like a killing, because imagine it's 5 v 3. Mafia kills a townie, and Preacher converts a town member. Now it's 3 v 4. The Followers are incentivized to stay, because if they convert back it just goes to 3 v 3. and Mafia wins'''

Second, this role creates Followers, which as you said are basically Survivors, out of members of the. There's no limit on who can and cannot become a Follower, so I'm assuming that you have a pool of nine townies to work with. Assuming the is a  and the  isn't afk, and both the Serial Killer and Mafioso target town members the first two nights, you still have an extremely high chance of getting both followers by Night Two.

'''There can be up to 5 Followers at a time. And Followers may quit at any point to join the town.'''

And that's if the town doesn't know who the Preacher is.

Why wouldn't the Preacher just reveal?

Once the Preacher reveals, up to five townies suddenly have the chance to win with everyone, so why wouldn't townies just reveal themselves as townies that are about to become Followers? Why wouldn't Followers reveal, they can win with everyone as well, and the Preacher and Followers can confirm each other.

'''If the town is winning - you want to be more useful so you convert back to town so you may use an ability. you will be killed by the mafia'''

'''If the mafia is winning - you are an extra vote. you will be killed by the town for an assured kill.'''

So I see two flaws with this role:

1: It would help the town significantly

2: It has an extremely easy win condition

If town is winning, they will convert back making it harder for mafia and losing Preacher.

You could make the win condition more difficult, or make it so that the Preacher cannot win with everyone, which would make Followers and Preachers less of a kingmaker. You could also impose additional limitations on who can and can't be a Follower.

If I've made a mistake and not made it clear that they can only win with Mafia and Neutrals let me say now, you can't win with Town.

I'm not sure how to keep it from helping the town, and that is the most significant thing, because the town really does win too much.

But this does have a unique win condition, realistic lore, and it's pretty well-defined and thought out!

​​​​​​​thanks!